Re: A Rare Haven for Gay Men and Lesbians in Harlem

and GEO hide like SADDAM HUSSEIN in a spider hole
because you have courage

and no faith

you bible belter




On 5/30/12, EARL DOYLE <lesjulia1@gmail.com> wrote:
> GOD the FATHER created them gay and GOD the FATHER is GOD the FATHER
> and GEO you southern PROTESTANT you ain't GOD the FATHER
>
> fact is your FILTH ;o) yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy cause your PROTESTANT
>
> now don't get bent all out of shape about it
>
> cause you know you're guilty OF EVERYTHANG yyyyyyyyyyy cause you're
> PROTESTANT
>
> now put your gun down HICK, TRAILER TRASH, GOOD OLE BOY, RED NECK, HONKY
>
> AND HIDE ;O)))))))))))))
>
>
>
> On 5/29/12, geoffrey theist <gtheist957@gmail.com> wrote:
>> you are right they choose to be gay or to engage in deviant sex .
>>
>> On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 8:20 AM, OccupySpring
>> <soprano.olivia07@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> God doesnt make people gay, Just like God doesnt make people
>>> Republican. They have brain damage, and that usually occurs because of
>>> toxins in the environment.
>>>
>>> On May 28, 11:01 am, Leader of 71 <lesjul...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > <http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/28/nyregion/black-gay-men-and-lesbians..
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>>> > A Rare Haven for Gay Men and Lesbians in Harlem
>>> > Ozier Muhammad/The New York Times<
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/28/nyregion/black-gay-men-and-lesbians...>
>>> >
>>> > While adhering to many traditions of black churches, Rivers at
>>> > Rehoboth
>>> has
>>> > made ministry to gay men and lesbians its mission.
>>> > By GERREN KEITH GAYNORPublished: May 27, 2012
>>> >
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>>> > <
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>>> >
>>> > In a church nestled among a row of residential brownstones,
>>> > parishioners
>>> > clapped and danced as a woman began to testify.
>>> > Connect with NYTMetro <http://www.facebook.com/NYTMetro>
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>>> .>
>>> > Ozier Muhammad/The New York Times
>>> >
>>> > Vanessa M. Brown, far left, who is gay, is the church's senior pastor
>>> > and
>>> > preaches what she calls a "radically inclusive" message. "God doesn't
>>> make
>>> > any junk," she said said. "He made us knowing who we were going to be
>>> > before we were it."
>>> >
>>> > "Aren't you glad Jesus got up?" the woman, Twanna Gause, asked the
>>> > predominantly black congregation, which responded with enthusiastic
>>> shouts
>>> > of "Amen" and "Hallelujah."
>>> >
>>> > "He got up so I can come out," Ms. Gause said, as worshipers hopped
>>> > out
>>> of
>>> > their seats and cheered in agreement. "He got up so you can come out."
>>> >
>>> > For black Christians who are gay and lesbian, church can be a daunting
>>> > experience, where on any given Sunday they are taught that
>>> > homosexuality
>>> is
>>> > not only a sin, but a one-way ticket<
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/28/nyregion/black-gay-men-and-lesbians...>
>>> to
>>> > hell. That alienation has been a benefit for the Rivers at Rehoboth
>>> > congregation, in Harlem, which has made ministry to gay men and
>>> > lesbians,
>>> > combined with the worship traditions of black churches, its mission.
>>> >
>>> > The congregation was formed by the merger of two churches, Rivers of
>>> > Living Faith andRehoboth Temple <http://www.rehobothtemple.com/>. The
>>> > pastor of Rivers, Vanessa M. Brown, 41, is a lesbian, and the pastor
>>> > of
>>> > Rehoboth, Joseph Tolton, 45, is gay, and both were born and raised in
>>> > Harlem. Their merged congregation rents space out of Grace
>>> > Congregational
>>> > Church on West 139th Street, where Mr. Tolton's former church
>>> > worshiped
>>> for
>>> > four years.
>>> >
>>> > Ms. Brown, the church's senior pastor and Ms. Gause's partner,
>>> > preaches
>>> > what she calls a "radically inclusive" message, while Mr. Tolton, the
>>> > associate<
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/28/nyregion/black-gay-men-and-lesbians...>
>>> pastor,
>>> > offers as a mantra the phrase "Gay by God."
>>> >
>>> > "God doesn't make any junk," Ms. Brown said. "He made us knowing who
>>> > we
>>> > were going to be before we were it."
>>> >
>>> > Only "small segments" of black church leaders openly welcome gay men
>>> > and
>>> > lesbians in their congregations, according to Lawrence H. Mamiya<
>>> http://religion.vassar.edu/bios/mamiya.html>,
>>> > a professor of religion at VassarCollege<
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/28/nyregion/black-gay-men-and-lesbians...>
>>> who
>>> > has researched black churches.
>>> >
>>> > "There's also a large majority that doesn't," Mr. Mamiya said.
>>> >
>>> > As evidence, he said that many black churches supported a ballot
>>> > measure
>>> > barring same-sex marriage<
>>> http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/s/same_s...>
>>> in
>>> > California.
>>> >
>>> > "That gives you some indication of how strong the opposition is," he
>>> said.
>>> >
>>> > But there have been some signs of change. This month, the board of the
>>> > N.A.A.C.P. voted to express its support for same-sex marriage.<
>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/20/us/politics/naacp-endorses-same-sex...>
>>> >
>>> > Rivers at Rehoboth is attended by an average of 200 members each
>>> > Sunday.
>>> On
>>> > Easter, ushers had to place folding chairs next to pews to accommodate
>>> > visitors, some of whom had traveled from as far as Italy and
>>> > Australia.
>>> >
>>> > Both pastors speak openly about their own experiences struggling with
>>> > sexuality as black Christians.
>>> >
>>> > Mr. Tolton said that for over 20 years, he believed his sexual
>>> orientation
>>> > was a spiritual demon from which he needed to be saved. As a young
>>> > man,
>>> he
>>> > asked clergy to pray for him to be straight.
>>> >
>>> > Mr. Tolton said he left his church after a friend told him he could
>>> > not
>>> be
>>> > the best man at his wedding because he is gay.
>>> >
>>> > "It broke my heart," Mr. Tolton said.
>>> >
>>> > Ms. Brown said she, too, struggled with the church's stance on
>>> > homosexuality.
>>> >
>>> > She said she married a man who was gay, to help him cover up his
>>> sexuality
>>> > and protect his image in the church. But Ms. Brown divorced him after
>>> > growing tired of living a lie, she said.
>>> >
>>> > "I was ruining my own self," she said. "I wasn't happy."
>>> >
>>> > Many members of the Rivers at Rehoboth have their own stories.
>>> >
>>> > Derrick Smith, 26, who found out that he had contracted H.I.V. shortly
>>> > before joining Mr. Tolton's church in 2007, said he had been asked to
>>> step
>>> > down as the organist at his former church in the Bronx when he told
>>> people
>>> > of his sexuality. He said he learned about Mr. Tolton's church on a
>>> > promotional postcard at a support clinic for gay black men in East
>>> Harlem.
>>> > After a couple of visits, Mr. Smith joined the church and has been an
>>> > active member since. He now serves as the church's sound technician.
>>> >
>>> > "I believe it helped save my life," Mr. Smith said.
>>> >
>>> > Julie Chisolm-May, who attends the church with her wife, Stacey, said
>>> > before joining Rivers at Rehoboth, they attended separate churches for
>>> > about eight years because of the glares they would get from people
>>> > when
>>> > they were together. Ms. Chisolm-May said if she and her wife had not
>>> found
>>> > Rivers at Rehoboth, they would probably be worshiping from their
>>> > bedroom,
>>> > watching ministers preach on television.
>>> >
>>> > "It's the safest place to go without being condemned at the end of
>>> > service," she said.
>>> >
>>> > Now, she said, her entire family attends the church, including her six
>>> > adult children, and her 74-year-old mother, who changed her views on
>>> > homosexuality when she joined the congregation.
>>> >
>>> > The pastors say they are now looking for a larger space in which to
>>> expand.
>>> >
>>> > "We want people to know that they are loved, there's a safe space for
>>> them
>>> > in the house of God," Ms. Brown said, "where they can truly worship
>>> > the
>>> > Lord and be their authentic selves."
>>> > A version of this article appeared in print on May 28, 2012, on page
>>> > A15
>>> of
>>> > the New York edition with the headline: A Rare Haven for Gay Men and
>>> > Lesbians in Harlem.
>>> >
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